This one is a full-circle conversation for me.
Amber Heinrich and I met in corporate. We were in the same practice area, both in communications, and both vegan when that was a rare thing to find in a conference room. We’ve both since stepped away from the corporate consulting world, and now she's written a book.
Debug Yourself: Reprogram Your Mind, Body & Spirit for Well-Being is the book Amber wishes she'd had when she was burned out. After 25 years of leading people through change, her own resets stopped working. So she collected the tools that helped, built a framework (she's a consultant, of course there was a framework), and five years later, it became a book.
In this episode, you'll hear:
How Amber went from "executive hippie" in corporate boardrooms to coach and author, and why she rebelled against her bohemian childhood by going to business school
Why she drafted most of the book by hand, often rushing in the door after a morning walk because she couldn't hold the ideas any longer
The 30,000 to 35,000 words of personal story she cut, and why she calls it memoir material for another book
Her three proposals through a writing community: one that went nowhere, one that earned editorial feedback that reshaped everything, and one that won a publishing package
How every section she revised seemed to bring a life challenge that tested the advice she was writing
The moment her book went on sale while she was in Delphi, on a trip she'd promised herself she'd be fully present for
Why her real voice came easily in the book, but the corporate voice creeps back in when she sits down to market it
Her advice for the woman just out of corporate who thinks there's a book in her: start with your stories, and write down what each one taught you
Meet Amber:
Amber Heinrich is the author of Debug Yourself: Reprogram Your Mind, Body & Spirit for Well-Being — a science-informed, soul-rooted guide for changing the internal patterns that shape how you think, feel, work, and live. Drawing on neuroscience, ancient healing traditions, and lived expertise leading people and organizations through transformational changes, Amber offers a modern doorway into timeless wisdom. She is a life and business coach, author, certified hypnotherapist, yoga and meditation teacher, and a former corporate executive. Amber founded Spirit Stone Wellness to help people navigate change without stress and find joy, purpose, and energy in all areas of work and life. She is the creator of The PATH of Well-Being, a framework now used in coaching programs, online courses, immersive retreats, and Debug Yourself.
Links
Visit Amber’s Website: https://spiritstonewellness.com/
Get Debug Yourself: https://bit.ly/debugyourselfbook
Book a call with Amber: https://call.spiritstonewellness.com/scheduling
Connect with Amber: https://spiritstonewellness.com/link-in-bio
Connect with Jacqueline Fisch:
If you loved this episode, listen to these next:
-
Amber: [00:00:00] it was more about me and stories that I needed to write and get out. I stripped 30, 30, 35,000 words- ... out of the first draft because it was all just stories that I needed to write for myself but really wouldn't help anyone else as much as the actual content.
Hi, I'm Jacqueline Fish. Welcome back to the How Women Write podcast. I'm recording this on Monday, October 19th, and I'm trying something new with the podcast starting today. If you've listened to Joanna Penn's podcast, The Creative Penn, she was on the How Women Write podcast a few weeks back, you know that she opens every episode with an update, introduction on what's going on in her life, what she's exploring, some news, how business is going.
As a fellow authorpreneur, I love this, and I wanted another way to bring you [00:01:00] updates without doing a whole separate episode. So this is the first one I'm doing it with, and I'm really excited to hear what you think about it. I'd love for you to get in touch
so from now on, before each guest, you're going to hear me share what's going on, what's on my desk, what's happening in my writing life. Honest stories behind the magic you see on the podcast. Right now, I am deep in writing The Billet Season. It's a story of my son moving out last year at 17 to play juniors hockey up north.
Really, it's a story about letting go, and I know this resonates with other moms, especially other moms whose kids have also gone off to play hockey. And I'm writing this out loud on Substack each week. I think I'm on chapter 10. I have a goal to finish it by December 20th, and that leaves me at about two chapters a week.
But as I get in there, I'm really also discovering that some need to be [00:02:00] combined, so , it's rough here and there. But keeping that schedule is really helping me stay on track, and writing it on Substack out loud so you can see the false starts. I'm sharing behind the scenes, this is what's going on, this was the mood of the day, didn't really feel like writing today, but here it is.
That kind of thing. I'm sharing all of that behind the scenes on Substack. So if you want to read that, come find me over there. And one honest thing, and this pairs really well with Amber's episode, I am in the process, I'm almost done, of rebuilding two of my websites. My jacquelinefish.com website used to be for one-on-one work and my author site.
Instead, I've shifted that, and that is now my consulting site, because I do work with executives on voice and coaching, mentoring, teams, workshops, speaking, training, . That lives there, as well as my books. Now, the Intuitive [00:03:00] Writing School site, my one-on-one work lives there, the one-on-one mentorships, -
and book coaching
I have to say, writing copy for people for 10 years and then . Writing for yourself is often harder than writing for other people. I find it anyway. But that process is almost done. I'm just cleaning up some back end things on the websites, making sure that I don't have broken links.
Right now I probably do have broken links. I'm going to fix those. So this is why I love this conversation today that you're going to hear with Amber. Her and I worked together in the corporate world years ago. We both left. I left in 2017. She was some years after that. And we both had to figure out what our real voice sounded like on the other side.
We both have a different experience with that as well. So for me, it took years of stripping away what I learned. But for Amber, her voice was already there. Writing the book for her was the easy part. [00:04:00] It was the marketing, though, that pulled her right back into corporate speak mode. So if you've ever written something and then froze when it came time to talking about it, I think you'll love what you hear in this episode.
Here's Amber
Jacqueline: I am so excited for today's guest. I was thinking about how I wanted to start this off 'cause there's so many directions I wanna go in, and is so fun and such a big full circle moment for me. Amber Heinrich is here with me. She and I met when we were in the corporate space.
We worked together. We were in the same practice area. We interacted. I left the company. She left the company, and now she wrote a book. And she's in communications, or was, and as am I, and I think people in communications just naturally want to stay connected.
It's natural. So her new book just landed, Debug Yourself. It's a hefty book. There's a lot packed in there, and I'm so [00:05:00] excited to get into the details. Before we get to that, Amber, welcome. I'd love for you to share who you are, what you're doing these days. Thank
Amber: you. Yeah, and thank you for the warm introduction.
Yeah, you're right, communications people are definitely drawn to connections, you know? That's just funny. As I was thinking through what this conversation would be like, connections kept coming up, so yeah, this is a wonderful reconnection that we made. I am the founder of Spirit Stone Wellness, which you can see behind my head.
That's my coaching business. And the book, Debug Yourself did come out of my 25 years of corporate experience. It's the stuff that kept me sane, all packaged together. So yeah, what I'm doing now is a little different than what I did throughout my entire career.
When Jacqueline and I knew each other, worked together, yes, I was doing change leadership and communications and marketing but mostly helping companies move through change, and [00:06:00] my part of that was helping people move through change, 'cause change is a very disruptive thing.
And I happen to love change actually and enjoyed helping people, moving through big changes. And now I'm doing that, but I'm doing it more on a personal level. So, as a life and a business coach helping people move through the big changes in their life.
Jacqueline: I love that. And I remember connecting with you early on.
Are you still vegan?
Amber: I am, yeah.
Jacqueline: Okay, 'cause that was one of the things we connected on. Yeah. I don't remember how it came up, but in the corporate world you're like, "Oh, I'm vegan." I'm like, "Oh my God, me too." It's like something you don't run into a lot, and you're like, "My people. This is so cool."
Amber: It's so true.
Yeah, and the company that we both worked at together, like, right before I started is when, we decided to be vegan, and it was, like, more than 15 years ago, something like that. Yeah. Something in that space, , a long chunk of time. And being vegan then was hard. The only thing that we knew that was [00:07:00] vegan at the time, 'cause it wasn't on menus, it wasn't, like, a thing that you brought up- Right
or it wasn't a very known thing as it is now, you know, but we found ourselves eating, like, way too much pasta. So- It's so good ... it was the only thing we knew that we could cook that was vegan, but that's changed, yeah.
Jacqueline: Yeah. I love that. In your book, and I don't know if I ever remembered you talking about this when we worked together, but you call yourself an executive hippie-
at the time. So I also wish I knew that back then because I would be like- I know ... more things we can connect on. Yeah. Talk to me about that and you growing up in a, I guess a certified hippie household. W- tell us about that,
Amber: please. Yes, yeah. So it's legit. Like, my hippie background is definitely legit.
So, my parents were both hippies. There were different kinds of hippies, I mentioned this in the book, so if you've read a little bit of that, you know, and you're reading this, my mom, was the sort of peace, love, and happiness sort of hippie. My dad was more on the, like, sex, drugs, rock and roll kind [00:08:00] of hippie, and that really worked for a while, and it, it didn't later.
But , in the course of my growing up, I had a very just bohemian childhood, and it was wild and exciting. And I just came into contact with so many different, new, concepts, people, ways of being. So it really, I think from an early age it opened me up, to, to different kinds of people and experiences and things, yeah. So, when you go through being a teenager then, and, early adulthood, you're a little bit rebelling. So what am I rebelling against? I'm rebelling against my bohemian upbringing, which is most people go the opposite. So my rebelling was going into business school. So- That's funny
I actually... Yeah and then I took more of the corporate route after that, but I held on to m- my hippie roots, but I was always a little bit of an outlier. I always felt a little bit strange in business rooms because I was this more of an executive hippie, yeah.
Jacqueline: I love that.
. What about early memories of reading and writing? Mm. Were you one of those [00:09:00] kids that was- Like, I'm gonna write a book someday
Amber: Oh, yeah. Yeah. I , my mom, you know, got me into reading very early, and it was something I absolutely loved. You know, so I still remember, uh, we would read together every night.
You know, like , I was reading books. I would st- I would get in trouble for staying up late reading because I'd be under the covers with a flashlight, like trying to finish the rest of the book. So reading, writing, that was, yeah, definitely early childhood loves for me. Um, I jokingly, you know, when I announced, you know, my, my book was being published also included my first book, which was a animal flip book that I made when I was probably like, I don't know, seven, eight, something like that.
I don't know. Yeah. But it was a little flip book that I wrote and illustrated, and that was like technically my first book. But so I... And I actually, like I've been writing stories, short stories, poetry. You know, like I, I just, I love writing, and it's how I work out what's in my head and also how I make [00:10:00] connections between different things and how I share the wisdom that's helped me.
You know, like yeah, reading, writing, like that's, that's been a through line I think since, ever since I can remember. Is that the same for you or? I imagine probably.
Jacqueline: Not quite. Yeah. It was more art.
Amber: Mm.
Jacqueline: It was more the visual arts. Yeah. It wasn't really writing. I was good at it. It was one of those things that- It was when you're good at something, and not...
You don't get a ton of praise for it, but you're just, you're good. Yeah. And everyone just expects you to be good at it. It was, like, not dramatic. Like, I remember straight As in English class.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: And it was my easy class, but I never thought about going into writing.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: Oh, interesting. And are you- But it was food that brought me there.
Like, after I went vegan, that's when I- Yeah ... started the food blog.
Amber: Oh, wow. Oh, that, I didn't know that. That's what kinda got you into... Oh, that's cool.
Jacqueline: Yeah. And then like you, working in a corporate setting, you're writing-
Amber: Yeah ...
Jacqueline: in a different way. So in the corporate world, did you have a [00:11:00] balance between writing, did you write poetry or anything else on the side while you were doing very corporate, buttoned-up- I
Amber: did
Jacqueline: kind of
Amber: writing? Yeah. I did. And, in a way poetry was the, a way that I've never really shared any of my poetry but it is more of a way of making things that might be ugly or conflicting into something of beauty, so it was kind of like a, this, like, alchemy process of working out what's what's churning, or things that aren't matching up, or things that are kind of, you know, ugly or everyday, and making it in- into something beautiful.
So, like, poetry for me yeah, it was a lot of working my stuff out. Yeah.
Jacqueline: Well, I'm glad you had that.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: And in your book, you say you wrote the book you wish you had-
Amber: Yes ...
Jacqueline: when you were burned out. Yes. Tell us about your brand of corporate burnout. That we've all-
Amber: Everyone's got a little of that, right?
Jacqueline: I know, right?
Amber: Yeah. And even when I was, like, writing in corporate, like you had asked I did try and bring an element. Like, I choose words very [00:12:00] intentionally when I'm writing. I tend to think out loud when I'm talking, but when I'm writing it's very intentional, you know? So-
Even if it wasn't a poem in corporate, it was, like, very intentionally, for me , that was also a little therapeutic, to write things and do that very intentionally. But the book, that, yeah, that, that was born out of burnout. There's no way around that. There I got to the point, and I think a lot of people can identify with you get to the point where you're feeling just depleted, or you're running on autopilot, or you feel like a zombie.
You know, so for me, I had all these, hippie practices that I, wouldn't, it... I mean, nothing, like, too ridiculous. You know, I'm not, like, burning sage, through the house every day. Not that that's a bad
Jacqueline: thing, but- I don't think that's ridiculous at all.
Amber: No. But I was, like, doing yoga, doing meditation- Yeah
Those are, g- those kind of things. But all the resets that, I was used to working, you know, started not working, and I was like, "Whoa, okay, wait a minute. There's something bigger at play here I need to understand." [00:13:00] And for me, , it just felt like this full mind, body, spirit exhaustion that I was not used to.
And what I came to find out is that, hey, stress is a thing that needs to be reset, otherwise the faucet stays on, so if you're not getting the reset or you're not, resetting as thoroughly that stress response, that biological normal stress response that is, built into all of us, it just keeps running, so you're accumulating stress.
And I just, , accumulated to the point that I needed a, a bigger sort of, a reset, and it was more of a reprogramming is how I saw it. So I was like, I went back to what are all the things that have helped me before, , and then I got really nerded out and going back to, different wisdom traditions, what are the things that tie together, like, what are the similarities, and I think in writing the book, it started as collecting all the things that have helped me before and putting them together in a way [00:14:00] that I could come back to and repeat, if I ever found myself in this, burnout situation again, 'cause I didn't want that. You know?
So I put together sort of, I'm a consultant, you know, like, it was a- Of course ... framework, so yeah, of course there had to be a framework around it, but yeah, I put together the things that worked for me, and then I ran myself through it a few times, and it's like, hey, well, th- this actually works.
Maybe I'll put this together in some sort of organized form and share it, with a few people. Yeah. And then, yeah, like five years later it was actually a book, which is kind of still surreal to me, actually. Yeah,
Jacqueline: that's interesting. Yeah. So the spark to create something was burnout. When did you realize it was a book?
Amber: I've always known that I would write a book at some- Yeah ... like, it's just one of those things that, you know, it's like this little itch that's scratching. So it could've been that, but I knew it was a book when I couldn't publish it in a blog. Okay. When it felt more substantial, you know?
And [00:15:00] actually when I realized, wow, like I think this might actually help more people than me, like maybe there's some kind of a responsibility, when you have something that you think could be really helpful to share that, and-
...
Amber: It was too big for a blog and it was too woo woo, you know, for, a, a corporate class, it was... Yeah, so like I experimented, like how could I share kind of these things, and what would that look like? And I just collected so much that I was like this needs to be organized, and then in the process of organizing it, it just sort of became a book, and then the book changed like at least...
I mean, I probably changed the title like 10 times. The- Yeah ... the framework changed. That's totally normal. Like, the whole, p- yeah, like w- what it looked like five years ago and what it looks like now is totally different, but a lot of the, the content is the same.
Jacqueline: Okay. Yeah. So talk to us about the writing process.
It sounds like it came organically out of something you were creating-
Amber: Yeah ...
Jacqueline: and took five years to come together. Did the [00:16:00] heart of what's in there change? Were you like, "Oh, no, it's this kind of book," or, "It's this kind"? Mm. What did that look like?
Amber: Uh, to be really honest, when I started there was a little bit more ego in it, you know?
Um, and .. it started off being the things that I wanted to share versus now it's more... And it's still stuff I wanna share, but like it was more about me and stories that I needed to write and get out. I stripped 30, 30, 35,000 words- ... out of the first draft because it was all just stories that I needed to write for myself but really wouldn't help anyone else as much as the actual content.
So it... Yeah, so when I say there was more ego in it, there was just like more me in it. There was more- Yeah ... identity in it. There was me finding my identity, finding my voice, and then, taking that. Like, there may be a place for that someday, but I took that out and I was like, "That's memoir material."
[00:17:00] What's actually useful for people? And one of the things that also sparked me to share when I was in that burnout period, was I got really annoyed that- I asked myself this, this question because I was really annoyed at where kind of I was and the state of hu- like, all of humanity, you know?
So I was like, "We have so much wisdom. Like, why isn't it working?" We know pretty much all the things that- ... that we need to know to be, like, kind, yes, like, uh, productive, but balanced, well people, you know, that are working together. Why Why isn't this wisdom working?
So- Yeah ... that was also one of the, the questions , that started the book and why I packaged it the way I did, was starting with, you know, wisdom, why isn't it working? Oh, well, we all have a responsibility to take the things that really light us up and share those.
And I had a mentor at the time Patrick Mosier, who wrote the forward to my book. [00:18:00] Yeah. And he has this, got this great quote, like, "Wisdom isn't wisdom until it's shared," and I was like, "Yeah. Okay." Like, I need to package this up. What is the real wisdom nuggets? What can actually help people?
I need to share that. And yeah, there may be a time or place for the other parts of my story, but- Yeah ... this isn't that.
Jacqueline: Yeah. I love that. I took about 30,000 words out of my first book too.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: It's normal. And you have material for another day. Right.
Amber: Right.
Jacqueline: One of the
Amber: best parts. I, like, have a book just sitting there.
Yeah. Yeah, so but I think you'd asked about the process, and I was thinking about that a little bit. For me, , writing anything, including, like, how I kind of massaged, sections of the book, it kind of starts, like, I, I do a walk in the morning typically.
, Not so much in Chicago when I was there because it was really cold, but now that I'm in Scottsdale, Phoenix area- Yes ... it's a lot more accessible. But I get inspiration when I'm walking, in and out in nature. So, that's where it kind of starts with me, and then I [00:19:00] start noodling on a question or an idea, and then by the time I get home, I'm like, "Oh my God, I can't contain this anymore, I gotta write it down," so then I'm, like, writing it out by hand, and then it becomes an exercise of refining and organization and, where does this fit? Yeah ... but I remember running in the house a few times just like, "I can't remember this any longer, I have to write it down."
Jacqueline: That's great.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: I love that. Uh, well, one, the idea of walks and not sitting at a page trying to force- Yeah ... something out is just so much easier. Yeah. So did your drafts mainly contain your handwritten notes and then you moved them to a document?
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: That's huge. Yeah, my... Yeah. That is a lot of work.
Amber: It was a lot of work.
I don't have a stake in Scrivener but- ... you know, if I were to invest in a writing tool, like that would be, yeah, that would be the one. Like, Scrivener was really helpful for me. It was just a way, like, 'cause I was moving pieces and parts. Like, I had this framework, I changed the framework.
So all the pieces and [00:20:00] parts, moving those around so much, like, I started doing that in a Word document and then just wanted to tear my hair out, like, every time I made a big substantial change. Yeah. So having a good writing tool that allows you to move the pieces and parts, I think that- That was huge, .
Jacqueline: Okay. I've heard a lot of good things about Scrivener. I have not adopted it. Don't fix what isn't broken, right?
Amber: Yeah, exactly. Yeah. The- do your thing. But yeah, most of ... my book started as handwritten.
Jacqueline: I love that.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: Well, there's so much research on how it slows our brain down, how you're connecting to-
Your soul, your higher self. It just comes out, and the filter's gone because- it's on paper, and I think a lot of people find it doesn't feel as vulnerable-
Amber: Mm-hmm ...
Jacqueline: because it doesn't have the chance of making it online or anything like that- Right
yet.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: So you get to do some edits between writing and the typing. Right.
Amber: Like, if it's in a journal, and I have always been a big journaler, if that's a word. [00:21:00] Yeah. Sure. I journal quite a bit, and yeah, you could always chuck a journal in the fire. You know, it's not online.
It's not out there, so yeah. Exactly. There is a little bit of that. And also just, , the feeling of it. Like, a, a pen in my hand and just free writing like that, that feels so good to me. It, it's very relaxing. It's one of those-
Jacqueline: Yes.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: Yeah, and when you are relaxed, your nervous system is calm, and the words can come.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: And walking does that too, right? Yeah. So I also love that you wait till the creative well is filled, until it's going to burst.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: Then you just come to the page and let it out. Yeah. I love that.
Amber: Yeah. I've had-- I know some people record voice memos and things- Yeah ... when they're writing.
But for me, I don't know. Like, the writing always had to start by hand. That's, um... Not that I was opposed to it. I'm sure if I did the recording that would be a lot easier. But then I- it felt like, oh, if I record it, then I'll have to do a transcript of it. Then, which is a lot easier now, like- Yes ... that's a pretty easy thing to do. But, like, for me I just love the act of [00:22:00] writing on paper, you know- Yeah ... so much that I wouldn't wanna trade that.
Jacqueline: So good. Were there any big challenges you bumped into in the writing or editing?
Amber: Oddly let's see. Challenges. Uh, yeah, there are a few. I mean, I'm so appreciative, of, I, so I went through a, writing boot camp and with Hay House has a writing boot camp.
And so I signed up for that, and as part of that, you know, I was in the community. And being in that community, you had an opportunity to submit a proposal, a book proposal twice a year. So I submitted my first one. I'd already, written most of the book. I was just at the point where I'd stripped, like, the 30,000 words out, and I'd kind of revamped it a little bit, and I felt like, "Ah, yeah, this is it."
So I submitted a book proposal. Didn't go anywhere, but the act of writing the book proposal for me was also kind of eye-opening, 'cause you have to do a marketing plan. You have to think through, yeah, how you would promote this. You have to think through, if the book isn't fully [00:23:00] completed yet, like, what each chapter is and how it relates.
So, my first book proposal after I submitted that, like- Almost a- as soon as I hit submit, I was changing the book, so that was a little bit of like, "Oh, wow, if they like this, I'll change it back, I guess." But it ended up not going anywhere, but then I submitted again, and I got an honorable mention which then led to getting some editorial feedback- which was gold. But then that changed the book entirely again. Right. So and I'm now on proposal number three, submitted that, and ended up winning the contest, and getting the publishing package. But, , through all of that the scrutiny, I guess, that I was putting my book and through in developing the proposal ended up changing it.
So, that was challenging, you know- ... in and of itself. But more on the, I guess, a little bit on the woo woo side, the, the most challenging thing is every time I went into the book and was, like, you know, writing, changing things, [00:24:00] in each section it seemed like I would have some big life challenge or something that was-
Apropos to whatever was going on in the writing. So, yeah I felt like writing the book was making me live the advice that I was giving through the book. Yeah. Every time I went through it, and I was discovering more about myself. I was discovering, like, where, "Hmm, is that really right, Amber?"
So I was questioning a lot. I was reflecting a lot. So, I feel like I went through all the exercises in this book so many times, and with each time, like, different things came up, different challenges came up. And ultimately, that's one of the reasons I realized, hey, not only if you go through this once, 'cause I've been through it once, you know- Mm-hmm
It kind of introduces a new way of being. And then if you go through it again it becomes a little bit like a map. So I found myself like, "Oh, I recognize this particular challenge in my life, is something that fits [00:25:00] very well with what I should be telling myself from the next section."
Right. So, . i think that was the challenge is that life kept throwing me things that made me consider and reconsider what I was writing, to the point where I actually felt good about, yeah, okay, this, this I feel good sharing. It feels authentic. It feels genuine. I've been through it enough that I can actually recommend this to someone else.
Jacqueline: Yes.
.
Jacqueline: Writing a book absolutely changes you in ways that you can't- even plan for.
Amber: Oh, yeah. Yeah.
Jacqueline: As you just shared.
Amber: Yeah, it makes you question yourself in so many different ways. Not only , am I a good writer, will this help anyone?
Is this book ever going to get on a shelf? Like, there's lots of things that challenge you, you know, when you're writing a book. But I think the biggest challenge, yeah, for me, was just life throwing things, back to almost like, "All right, you got this?" You know, like-
Jacqueline: Yeah ... "
Amber: You sure this is what you wanna say?"
You know?
Jacqueline: You're [00:26:00] like, "Okay. Yes, I will." I love your voice in the book, too. It's playful. Doesn't sound like someone who spent 25 years-
Amber: Yeah ...
Jacqueline: in the corporate world. Did that take some time for you to tap into and strip away some of the corporate voice? Or was it natural because you'd been doing other writing all along?
Amber: I think, That's my actual voice, you know, that came through in the book. Yeah. I modified it significantly to fit into corporate.
Jacqueline: Yes. That makes sense. And,
Amber: yeah, so yeah, it was more like, "Oh, wow, I can write something and be, like, fully myself," so yeah, the voice in the book is...
That, that's the voice that I bring to coaching sessions. Yeah. That's the voice that I hear in my head, um, yeah, I definitely needed to change that in corporate, quite a bit, but yeah, like, that, that was the easy part oddly. Yeah.
Jacqueline: Good. '
Amber: Cause I felt that-
Jacqueline: I love that that was your experience. Mine was more the opposite. Oh, was it? I did so much taking on the corporate writing, and [00:27:00] even writing for other people, I took that on as, like, what's my voice anymore? Oh. I don't even know what mine is anymore.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: So it took a stripping down to get back to it.
So I love that you went into it knowing. It's like, "Okay, I'm putting my corporate hat on." Doing corporate
Amber: voice. But I know that struggle, and where it hits me is on the marketing side. 'Cause ... I had so much experience in marketing and communications, that when I go... Writing the book was me, but somehow I shift into this weird corporate mode when I go to promote it, and I keep catching myself being like, "Ugh," "That doesn't sound like, what I would s- Like, why can't I bring this voice to the marketing in the same way that I could bring it to the book?"
So I felt like my marketing... it's a struggle to make that, feel like me in the way that the book was never a struggle to write, right. But yeah, it's that programming. It's like, "Oh, I can't say that. This is, official corporate marketing." You know? Like, so that I'm still struggling [00:28:00] with that.
Jacqueline: Yeah. I mean, that makes sense. Most self-published authors or hybrid house, whatever you do, marketing is the biggest sticking point, where it's like, how do I talk about this work? Like, this thing that you've poured your life into, five years- Right ... of your life, and you're like, "Okay, here. Buy it." And you're like- Yeah
"I just wanna write." Yeah.
Amber: I just
Jacqueline: wanna write. "Can someone else do this for me?" Right.
Amber: Exactly. Yeah. And that, the book ironically, like, being all about programming, helped me realize I need to deprogram how I market, how I talk about this, so it sounds natural, but , all that programming is definitely, uh, sticky.
Jacqueline: Yes.
Amber: Yeah.
Jacqueline: That's a generous word. We're calling it sticky. Yeah.
Amber: It's sticky. Yeah.
Jacqueline: Has there been anything that's surprised you since you published the book?
Amber: Um, oh my gosh. Yeah, so a lot of the book, you know, talks about, synchronicities or [00:29:00] serendipitous things that, you know, that happen and paying attention to those.
So with that in mind, I, when I signed off on the final interior and the final cover for the book, they managed my expectations, like, as a consultant, I have appreciation, for, like-
Jacqueline: Yes ...
Amber: managing the client's expectations. But they said, you know, "It's gonna take a while before, it- it's gotta go through our process, go to the printer, you know, get set up.
So, like, expect this to take a little time." And I was like, "All right. Cool, cool, cool." 'Cause I was going on an international trip. I was going to Delphi for this wisdom council and it's this event I was looking forward to. You know, my own personal development, professional development, investment into myself.
You know, I haven't done that in a while. So it and just going to Greece and Delphi so excited about this trip, so excited to just- Yeah ... h- leave the book in a good place and n- know that when I come back, I'll have a chance to decompress and, and then, in a few weeks it'll be ready and we can start the marketing plans.
And in my head, I had this whole timeline [00:30:00] All worked out. And then what actually happened was the second day of the Greece trip, where we had spent the first in Athens and then, on the next, second day commenced the time in Delphi, which was kind of the meat of the trip.
So I'm sitting there in Delphi and I got the notice from the publisher that, "Your book's available for sale." And I was like- "Oh."
Jacqueline: I'm not ready.
Amber: I'm not ready. And, and not only that, like, I'm doing this thing that is an investment of my time and my energy and I'm also part of a small circle of people, so it's also to...
And I need to be present, not only for myself in that moment, but for, for them and for the experience. And the first part of my book is all about being present, so the irony, so I had this choice to make, like, do I try and be in both places? Do I just be here? This book has taken five years to get to this point.
Yeah. It can wait another week. , And then they started flooding my inboxes with stuff to approve, so, like, press release [00:31:00] a questionnaire to, get the press release started, a questionnaire to get the, the website started, which all, was kicked off, couldn't have been done before 'cause, I had to sign off on the actual- Right
product first. So the publisher's marketing team blew up my inbox, and I'm in Delphi, and I didn't even bring my laptop 'cause I'm not doing work. You know? Like- ... I've got a phone, a- and so, like, that was a test. That was a surprise. That was something that I had to also, , really challenge myself to walk the walk, you know?
Like, be present, so yeah, I decided to just ignore that, to tell the publisher, "I'm in Delphi for a week, I will get back to you when I'm in the States again." But that was surprising. That was hard. And yeah, another kind of big test of, the advice I'm giving.
You know, follow that yourself.
Jacqueline: Right. Yet another final one to drop in right at- ... the end, like, "Hey."
Amber: Yeah. "Keep walking the walk." Just in case we're paying attention to before. Yeah. Universe, mic drop. Yeah.
Jacqueline: With working with a [00:32:00] publisher, and because you changed the materials so many times, was there a point where it was with them and you- wanted to change something, and your hands were tied to like, "No, I can't do this anymore"?
Amber: I think we pretty much worked... There wasn't anything big structurally. There was one big surprise in that I thought the interior images could also be in color.
So there was a moment of sort of acceptance.
And it could be. I could have, like- The cover is obviously in color, the interior is all black and white. Yep. Like, but there was an option to make color images in the interior. But I didn't realize what that would do to the price. Yes. And I was like, "No, I want this to b- be accessible for more people."
So-
Jacqueline: Yeah ...
Amber: me being the, recovering control freak that I am, like was really envisioning this all being in color, the images, of the framework. And as the book takes people through the different sections of the framework, they all have [00:33:00] colors attached to them. And for me, that was so important, but then when I thought, "Is it so important that fewer people will actually have a chance to benefit from the content, because the price is high," so I had to weigh that. So ... I ended up keeping it black and white, and I think that was the right choice, but that was one of those, those points where I was like, "Oh, I would've done this a little differently."
Jacqueline: Yeah.
Amber: Perhaps. Yeah.
Jacqueline: I get that.
.
Jacqueline: , Thinking of a woman who's right out of corporate, kind of where you were, who's like, "I think there's a book in here," do you have advice for her? What would you say to her?
Amber: I think there's a book in everyone.
Jacqueline: Yeah, me too. Yeah.
Amber: Like, at least one. There's at least one book in everyone, and there's certainly multitudes of stories. So, I guess I would say to someone in corporate who's thinking, "There could be a book here," to start writing down the stories and the lessons. Because I actually started with [00:34:00] a spreadsheet, and writing down stories and what, what this taught me and ...
It helped me see, where some of the through lines were. So yeah even if it doesn't end up being a book, there's I think a lot of value in cultivating your stories and, practicing telling those and seeing where the through lines are, so yeah, if someone is thinking about doing a book, I would say, like, start with a few stories and, and- Yeah
see, yeah, see where that takes you. But yeah, there's a book in everyone. Yeah. At least one. Yeah.
Jacqueline: Such a consultant thing to say, start with a spreadsheet.
Amber: I know. Or a PowerPoint ... the girl out of consulting. You can't, take the consulting out.
Jacqueline: No, I love that. I know your book just came out, but do you have your mind on any future writing projects already?
Amber: That, yes, I do. And that was a surprise to me, yeah. 'Cause I fully anticipated, that coming later perhaps. But yeah, just walking this week I was like, "Oh, that's a [00:35:00] great blog. I gotta do that." So I think it's getting back to my blog 'cause I did actually put that on hold, because all the writing focus, all the editing focus, like all the time I had for words was basically put into the book for like a year.
So getting back to my blog is one. But then I was actually telling a friend of mine this story again, something else that happened on a walk, and she's like, "That should be a book." And I was like, "That could be a book." So, so yes, yeah. Like I, I already am starting to noodle on second book, but that will be a long noodling I think.
Jacqueline: Yeah. Let this one land first. I love that though. That's the beauty of creativity and writing. Once you unlock it-
Amber: Yeah ...
Jacqueline: flood gates are open, and there's just so much- Yeah ... more to come through.
Amber: Yeah, it was like, it was waiting. It was like, "Are you gonna write again?" Yeah. "Are you gonna write again?
You've been editing for, like, a year. Are you gonna write again?"
Jacqueline: I love that. Yeah, yeah. That is great. A fun question I always love to wrap with: Did you have a particular beverage you [00:36:00] liked to sip as you were writing or editing?
Amber: Ooh. So most of my writing is in the morning. Most of my editing is later in the day.
So when I'm writing, it's actually mushroom coffee. It used to be coffee, but I was writing so much it amped me up too much- ... and I had to take a little break from the actual coffee. So yeah, I've been getting into the mushroom coffee lately. Yeah. I love that stuff. So that was... Yeah, that was definitely yeah, a, a beverage that I've spent a lot of mornings with.
In fact, it's right here. You can't see. Yeah.
Jacqueline: I love it. Amber, thanks so much for being here. We will have all the links to your website and to get your book , in the show notes, so everyone can access that. Awesome. Get your book, get in touch. You also host retreats.
Amber: I do, yeah.
Jacqueline: You have all the different stuff.
Amber: So the speaking of being a consultant, like, the- Yeah ... the thing about being a consultant and, you know, thinking in frameworks is then it's like, how do I apply this framework in [00:37:00] different settings? So the retreats are a much more spacious, experiential, way of introducing, , the framework that's in the book, The Path of Wellbeing.
And I also, do , some other facilitating and workshops and things like that. But I love having something that I can present in multiple formats. Maybe that is the consulting part of me, but, like, that's- Super
Jacqueline: smart. Yeah. That's the author/entrepreneur way. I love it.
Amber: You know it.
Jacqueline: So good. Amber, thank you so much- Thanks for having me ...
Amber: for being here. Thank you for inviting me on the show. It's been so wonderful to reconnect with you, too,
Jacqueline: yeah. We will definitely be in touch.
That was Amber Heinrich. Her book, Debug Yourself, is out, and you will find it, plus her retreats and her work at Spirit Stone Wellness in the show notes. And the thing that made me laugh in here, maybe it made you laugh too if you come from the consulting world, was the spreadsheet. So Amber didn't start with a [00:38:00] book.
She started by writing down her stories and what each one taught her, and the book showed her what the through lines of that was. So if you've got stories like that and no idea what the shape is, the shape you want it to take, I invite you to start with Meet Your Book.
It was a recording of a session I did last month called The Threshold Workshop. It's an hour where I lead you through a guided visualization where you meet your book. The stuff people saw there live was amazing. The book covers they saw were not what they planned.
They realized that they even had an old book that they started that they were meant to finish and they thought they were done with. And , the surprising pieces of what they saw on covers and in the materials. So we will begin with writing the first few lines of that live in the workshop. It's such a great way to dive in with a book if you've [00:39:00] been circling a bunch of stories, not sure where to start, or if you're stuck in your book and can't seem to get back into it. You can find that at theintuitivewritingschool.com. And just so you know, if you are a studio member, that is found in your member area
And if you already know what you're writing and you're ready to write it and you want someone beside you every step of the way, that's my private writing mentorship. One-on-one with me, three months, there reviewing everything you write, regular meetings, staying in it with you
next week on the show, I'm excited for you to meet Karen Marcus. She's a 27-year copywriter and just wrote her first book. I love that we have the copywriting in common, though she has done it for much longer than me , and I'm excited to share the lessons from her book with you .
I will see you then.
